第一百二十九天

[nnozomi]

语法
不（没有）～了, not ~ any more
https://resources.allsetlearning.com/chinese/grammar/Expressing_%22not_anymore%22_with_%22le%22
(I think we've actually done this before, but review is good)

词汇
给, give (pinyin in tags)
(also used to indicate "doing something for someone," "here you are," etc.)
https://mandarinbean.com/new-hsk-1-word-list/

Guardian:
我没有奶奶了, I don't have a grandmother any more
是一个很重要的给我取的, a very important person gave it to me
给我闭嘴, do me a favor and shut up

Me:
我早饭不吃面包了。
我送给你一个生日礼物。

(其他评论回复后来，我好久头疼了）

Comments

[presumenothing]

不 and 给 together immediately makes me think of 不给面子, for some reason…

[nnozomi]

不给面子
...no respect? I couldn't find context in particular?

[presumenothing]

To embarrass someone, I suppose would be the most English-natural translation? Specifically by not according them the respect/niceties that social norms would demand. Like if you're at a 飲み会 but refuse to drink, that's probably 不给面子 to whoever's hosting it. Or any situation where the implicit assumption is that you're supposed to agree with what's being said but you disagree vocally instead, that's also 不给面子 especially if there's an outside audience, et cetera. It's an entire thing when conducting business in Chinese cultural contexts, I'm pretty sure, and there's probably a Japanese equivalent of it?

[cathyw]

I think I've seen this translated very literally as "face" in the sense meaning "dignity"/"reputation".

[presumenothing]

Yep, and I've definitely used "give face" and similar phrases IRL, but I feel like this is more a case of back-translation to English? Which is pretty handy anyway.

[nnozomi]

ah, okay! Thanks. I know the general outline but I wasn't sure if this was a particular set phrase. (I can imagine a Zhou Shen song somewhere titled 不给面子...) I can think of various Japanese equivalents but no single phrase, though as you know 面子 gets borrowed wholesale from Chinese and pronounced メンツ, it's just not quite as common.

Like if you're at a 飲み会 but refuse to drink, that's probably 不给面子 to whoever's hosting it.
(hello, Shen Wei!) unfortunately, this has been me every now and then...

[presumenothing]

Yeah, it's not really a set phrase – the usages get pretty self-explanatory so long as you know what 面子 refers to (see also 爱面子 and such) (alas, I am definitely a semi-regular committer of crimes against 面子 IRL, but luckily my supervisors aren't really the kind to care that much about it XD)

Hilariously I actually can't think of any lyrics that use it offhand, even on the non-Zhou Shen front, but there is a fairly popular song entitled 体面 (which, not exactly the same word but along a similar "face"/dignity vein).

ETA: Also, on the topic of similarities, does 给 feel similar to くれる to you, or is that just me? I've got them filed in the same mental bracket, at any rate 😂

[nnozomi]

the usages get pretty self-explanatory so long as you know what 面子 refers to (see also 爱面子 and such)
Good to know (especially in this 爱面子 country) and thanks~

does 给 feel similar to くれる to you, or is that just me? I've got them filed in the same mental bracket, at any rate 😂
YES yes it does! Glad to hear that it works that way in your head too! Kind of added to emphasize who's doing what for the sake of whom, even when not necessary to specify the exact facts of the matter...?

[presumenothing]

And equally annoying to render in English, too! Though I suppose "do me a favour and shut up" works in the specific case of 给我闭嘴 XD

[nnozomi]

And equally annoying to render in English, too!
Damn straight. Judicious use of pronouns and context, sigh...

Though I suppose "do me a favour and shut up" works in the specific case of 给我闭嘴 XD
you know, at a glance this comes up three times in the Guardian script and they're all directed at Lin Jing. Whoever named him 静 was either way too hopeful or just plain misguided...

[presumenothing]

Whoever named him 静 was either way too hopeful or just plain misguided...

The only way it could be worse is if his entire name was 安静 or 肃静, I suppose XD

[nnozomi]

The only way it could be worse is if his entire name was 安静 or 肃静, I suppose XD
Here Lin Jing can be grateful that he's a character in Guardian and not DMBJ (see: 吴二白，王月半等等）, where I'm sure he would actually be called An Jing...

[elenothar]

我没有奶奶了 😢

[nnozomi]

*sniff* I need to find something for late-episodes happier!Li Qian, but she doesn't really have many lines...

[elenothar]

Alas. I really like her, it would've been nice to have more screen time (guess we'll have to write more fic with her...)

[nnozomi]

(guess we'll have to write more fic with her...)
YES PLEASE.

[cathyw]

给 seems to be one of those places where my understanding of grammar breaks down. is it a verb? a preposition? either, depending on context? both, simultaneously? aaaaaaargh.

[nnozomi]

is it a verb? a preposition? either, depending on context? both, simultaneously? aaaaaaargh.
aaaargh indeed. I did some very rough searching which suggests that it can be either/both? My guess is that it functions as a preposition when it's used with another main verb (like 给我过来， 送给你明信片) but can also be a verb all on its own (like 他给了我礼物). HOWEVER, the operative word here is "my guess...".